SP&S Vs. NR: Which Do You Prefer ?

[when i was cruel]

I am curious how other Elvis super fans feel about these two new era Elvis albums based on emotional feeling or really just which tracks you lean more towards. Personally I prefer SP&S as it's way more of a grounded album with a flow of sweet songs that have a distinct sound that defines the album, (i.e. Red Cotton, Wines and spirits, sulfur, etc...) Further more NR seems to have a muddy recording and most of the songs aren't a easy listen upon first spin.

[Jeremy Dylan]

I prefer the production on SP&S, but the songs of NR. So what I really want is a studio recording of the show I saw in Liverpool.

[sheeptotheslaughter]

As SP&S is my least favourite Elvis album. It's National Ransom for me.

[Harry Worth]

I prefer the production on SP&S, but the songs of NR. So what I really want is a studio recording of the show I saw in Liverpool.

Yep, that was a good show in Liverpool!

National Ransom, simply by virtue of the fact that I am happy to listen to it all the way through in the car. SP&S isn't bad, it is just uneven and slightly distant.

[Emotional Toothpaste]

I prefer SP&S by some distance.

National Ransom has a couple decent tracks, and I have really tried to let it grow on me, but it just won't. It has a nice buried spot on my CD rack next to il Songno.

[SoulForHire]

I prefer the production on SP&S, but the songs of NR.

I agree

[Kevin Davis]

I prefer SP&S by some distance.

National Ransom has a couple decent tracks, and I have really tried to let it grow on me, but it just won't. It has a nice buried spot on my CD rack next to il Songno.

Wow, such different perceptions. I thought 'Ransom' was, front-to-back, Elvis's most appealing album in years--a kind of catch-all for his stylistic detours that made them all sound richer for being in each other's company. "A Slow Drag With Josephine," "You Hung The Moon," and "A Voice in the Dark" are all Costello of the highest caliber.

Of course, I love 'Sugarcane' too.

[the_platypus]

NR by far. Agree with Kevin Davis that it's top-tier EC. Love both albums, though.

[wordnat]

NR certainly tries harder, but it's a bit schizo. SP&S by a hair....

(C'mon -- they're both pretty great!)

[bambooneedle]

NR is more satisfying because it has more top-notch songs, and it is newer. SP&S is hampered by some already-done material. Both also have some pretty bad songs, not least the title-songs.

[Jeremy Dylan]

Needless to say I disagree with that last sentence. Sulphur to Sugarcane is my favourite Elvis Costello song. I'm quite keen on National Ransom too.

[bambooneedle]

^

JD, can you appreciate that most songs have a limited shelf life?
I enjoyed Sulphur To Sugarcane for maybe the first dozen times I heard it. After that it didn't gain from further listening and declined in appeal for me.

National Ransom the song I now like a bit more than I used to but not much more, because I now realize that it it a bit of a caricature of protest, thrown into the diverse hotpot that is NR for a bit of spice. It seems (when I listen to it) that EC is aware that practically no-one is really interested in what he has to say socially/politically anymore if they ever did and that these days the illusion, that any so-called music artist may be very credible to many in this sense, is gone.

[sulky lad]

Jeremy says

So what I really want is a studio recording of the show I saw in Liverpool.

Does that mean you do have my audience recording - it's not bad all things considered
I returned to SS&P about an month ago and listened in the car and found new delights - which implies that it works on several levels. I adore Josephine and Jimmie but was less impressed by many others (Stations Of the Cross seems like a very poor relation of My Dark Life) and so almost entirely due to the wonderful way T-Bone captured The Sugarcanes, I have to go with that rather than NR

[when i was cruel]

I mean NR is just so distant. It like Elvis went a made lots of different songs with absolutely no connection or genre and expected the gimmick he used of "this is how rock sounded in the 20s." Then expected it to sell. Where as SP&S is like very heartfelt with a better recording. And as we know NR was recorded like in a session or two inbetween SP&S.

[the_platypus]

And as we know NR was recorded like in a session or two inbetween SP&S.

Huh?

[Poor Deportee]

I agree that SPS sounds better, as a recording - in fact, I rate the sound achieved there as among EC's finest. There's something about the tones struck on songs like 'How Deep is the Red' or 'She Was No Good' that I find rich and all too rare. No one else seems to make music that sounds quite like that.

But ultimately albums are collections of songs. And NR has, by my reckoning, no fewer than seven compositions that would be standouts on any of his past records (we might disagree about which songs - my picks are Jimmie, Church, Moon, Bullets, Watson, Strangers, and Voice - but I'll bet most EC fans would come to a similar general conclusion about that record). This makes it, from a songwriting perspective, easily one of his top efforts in recent decades.

The idea that NR lacks a unifying 'concept' holds absolutely no weight with me. Elvis's concept records have all too often dampened and constrained his distinctive lyrical voice. NR is Elvis at his overflowing, creative best as a writer - a creativity that, for once, he allowed to flourish unconstrained by a Master Concept, except the vague 'national ransom' idea that represents no more restrictive a motif that the pseduo-soul stylings of Get Happy!! did.

[Emotional Toothpaste]

Poor Deportee, I don't prefer one over the other based just on songwriting, but on whether I want to hear it. That would be akin to just looking at the liner notes of each, without having ever listened to either one before and making a judgement purely on which offers the better writing. I don't think this is what you are saying, but it comes close. Its about music first for me. And I think thats what was intended by the original question, maybe I'm wrong. NR has too many "standout" songs that I just flat don't want to hear, regardless of the written words or ideas presented in them.

[Poor Deportee]

Poor Deportee, I don't prefer one over the other based just on songwriting, but on whether I want to hear it. That would be akin to just looking at the liner notes of each, without having ever listened to either one before and making a judgement purely on which offers the better writing. I don't think this is what you are saying, but it comes close. Its about music first for me. And I think thats what was intended by the original question, maybe I'm wrong. NR has too many "standout" songs that I just flat don't want to hear, regardless of the written words or ideas presented in them.

Fair enough, but when I talk about standout songs, I don't mean just the lyrics alone but rather the song in its entirety. That's why we say "songwriting" and not "lyric writing," although the latter is a key ingredient of course. Like I said, NR has about seven of these elite songs for me (along with a number of other 'merely good' tunes as well as two or three duds). I'm not sure how an Elvis Costello fan can NOT want to hear songs like 'Jimmie,' or 'Strangers,' or 'Voice,' but that's neither here nor there, I suppose.

[Top balcony]

Let me say at the outset I really like SP&S. The Secret Songs have morphed very well from their origins in "classical music" and Sulphur is a lot of fun. Fillers that sound fine - Shadows and Hidden, low spot Partners and highspot Crooked.

I was disappointed with NR. When the Sugarcanes played in Liverpool they were really "cooking on gas" and, like Jeremy, I'd expected that this would be the standard of the vinyl when if finally arrived on the ship. Remember how dreadful the distribution to the UK was? Anyway, think my expectations were lowered by the title track - this works much better with the Imps or even played solo in a Tom Waites stylee. Nevertheless, there are some real faves for me, inc Bullets and Five Small. My issue is that there are too many which don't hit these heights. Elvis confessed that he saw this release as a good old fashioned "double album". In the days when indeed this was the fashion, inevitably it consisted of a really great single album's worth plus load of lower quality. Just feel he may have fallen into this trap with NR. And whilst I'm at it I could never figure out why tracks on Ransack missed the cut on Ransom. Condemned Man and Poor Borrowed dress strike much more of a chord with me than Church, Hung, Strangers or Jezebell.

Colin Top Balcony

[thepopeofpop]

No contest. I think "National Ransom" might be the best album he's ever done. I agree that the sound is a bit ... muddy. Seems to be on purpose, given that it's the same team that did "SP&S". I have tweaked the sound to be more to my liking, and now it is fine.

[Kevin Davis]

And whilst I'm at it I could never figure out why tracks on Ransack missed the cut on Ransom. Condemned Man and Poor Borrowed dress strike much more of a chord with me than Church, Hung, Strangers or Jezebell.

'My Lovely Jezebel" I'll give you--the album certainly wouldn't have been any poorer for nixing that one. But "You Hung the Moon?" I think that's one of the finest, most nuanced vocal performances of Elvis's long career, with a lovely lyric to boot. Are you a "North" fan?

[Top balcony]

Are you a "North" fan?

No I'm not, North is my least favourite EC album. Anyway it would be tiresome if we all liked exactly the same things and to the same extent.

Best wishes

Colin Top Balcony

[Kevin Davis]

I only ask because--and this isn't meant to be condescending--I often wonder whether detractors of songs like "You Hung the Moon" (and, to that same end, albums like North) simply dislike that style of songwriting, or if they think Elvis's offerings in that vein are poor applications of it.

[Top balcony]

You may have something here, think Hung would suit a North - style context rather than NR?

Colin Top Balcony

[Otis Westinghouse]

NR by some distance.

Stations Of the Cross seems like a very poor relation of My Dark Life

There are some melodic similarities in their opening lines, but then they go their separate ways. My Dark Life is a fine piece, but I think Stations of the Cross is the best song he's done this decade. A worthy nephew of MDL, not a poor relation. It's already a mighty fine song, but then on 1.38 the high-voiced, two vocal lines element comes in and it then shifts up several gears into the sublime. One of very few recent EC songs that's really got under my skin and into my head the way you really want a song to.