I really didn't want to say anything on this thread until someone posts the ad. Is anyone here able to YouTube it? I've been searching daily and none of them (Krall/Legend/EC) have been put up yet.
It is not virtuous to say that you'll never change your mind or opinion on something. We all change. But I pretty much fully agree with Pophead. I became an EC fan in 1989 and I always appreciated how he was apart from other artists because he lived in then unfashionable Dublin, he didn't turn up in rehab, he was prolific, he said what he meant and part of that was calling out on other artists for mediocre or hypocritical behaviour. The three times I met him he was courtious and left this fan feeling very happy.
So what has changed? Well he's still hard-working, prolific and probably still courteous, aren't they the most important things? They should be. But somehow I am really disappointed that he's done an ad, even though it'll be explained away by saying "he doesn't mention the product", "he hasn't given them a song". Well, I'd prefer if he had given them a song - a writer can divorce themselves from a song. He might even have had a hit. Pete Townshend is quite pragmatic about this: put the songs out there. Let them be heard.
But it is what it is. The reality is that if a day's work on a commercial supports his way of life for a while so he can tour and make records then great. We don't want him back working at the vanity factory. If I was offered my year's salary tomorrow for a commercial so I could stop going to work and just write songs, I'd take it. Recording costs are now cheap, distribution can be done digitally, why bother with a record label? Fund yourself with an ad and DIY.
But I do think that EC's Dublin years were his glory years, but I'm biased and I was the right age at the right time. Everyone says 77-82, I'm voting for 1986-2002!
DrJ
ELVIS for LEXUS!
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A rope leash
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A little too much change...
Sure, people change...but in this case I think we should be looking for a pod in his basement.
What alexv said about Elvis' real ability to sell Lexus automobiles is right on. If Elvis drove a Lexus, I would change my mind about them, and around here I'm known as the Toyota hater.
As for the car being a hybrid, I didn't see that in the advertisement. As far as hybrids go...what a joke. Lord help them when the fuel cells fail. Hybrids are a token offering from the gods of internal combustion, designed to make people feel good about buying their incredibly wasteful machines. When they go goofy, we'll all be back to total oil-burners.
What is needed in the auto industry is real change and regulation. People driving 35-50 MPH back and forth to work do not need vehicles that will do 120. Get them out of their guzzlers by producing effecient electric city cars. Damn "the market" and "what people want". You want to save energy and the planet, don't you? Then get serious about it. The hybrid's a joke...the old Geo-Metro-Suzuki got better mileage...fixing one of those up makes more sense than spending thousands on technology that's destined to fail big time.
Well, I've decided it is the art. His next record better kick some ass.
What alexv said about Elvis' real ability to sell Lexus automobiles is right on. If Elvis drove a Lexus, I would change my mind about them, and around here I'm known as the Toyota hater.
As for the car being a hybrid, I didn't see that in the advertisement. As far as hybrids go...what a joke. Lord help them when the fuel cells fail. Hybrids are a token offering from the gods of internal combustion, designed to make people feel good about buying their incredibly wasteful machines. When they go goofy, we'll all be back to total oil-burners.
What is needed in the auto industry is real change and regulation. People driving 35-50 MPH back and forth to work do not need vehicles that will do 120. Get them out of their guzzlers by producing effecient electric city cars. Damn "the market" and "what people want". You want to save energy and the planet, don't you? Then get serious about it. The hybrid's a joke...the old Geo-Metro-Suzuki got better mileage...fixing one of those up makes more sense than spending thousands on technology that's destined to fail big time.
Well, I've decided it is the art. His next record better kick some ass.
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Emotional Toothpaste
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Who Shot Sam?
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Really, this has everyone's panties in a bunch?
Last edited by Who Shot Sam? on Fri May 18, 2007 4:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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A rope leash
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Sorry you don't "get" it...
...yes, but the applause is for them and not him.
Mayer sees a cool car in this ad? I hardly see a car at all.
Someone else sees a hybrid car? Where?
So, he doesn't actually say anything about the car, and that lets him off the hook? He isn't really using his image to sell product for a monsterously huge multinational corporation? He's not selling the car, he's just in the ad?!
...and you think I have a funny way of looking at things?!
puhleez
Mayer sees a cool car in this ad? I hardly see a car at all.
Someone else sees a hybrid car? Where?
So, he doesn't actually say anything about the car, and that lets him off the hook? He isn't really using his image to sell product for a monsterously huge multinational corporation? He's not selling the car, he's just in the ad?!
...and you think I have a funny way of looking at things?!
puhleez
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And No Coffee Table
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It only took 18 days and four pages of posts...and ANCT comes through with one of the most coherent things I've read anywhere on any subject.And No Coffee Table wrote:He's been using his image to sell product for monstrously huge multinational corporations since 1977. Where have you been? Haven't you noticed his major label record deals? His appearances on commercial television? His magazine interviews and photo shoots? His movie roles?
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A rope leash
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I already said it...
From a rope leash post, right here on page three of this thread:
"Really, you know, he probably sold out when he decided to go professional as a rock star. It's all a gigantic mass deception, anyway."
ANCT :
"Haven't you noticed his major label record deals? His appearances on commercial television? His magazine interviews and photo shoots? His movie roles?"
Can't you see how that is different from taking a bag of cash from an advertising agency for promoting a product he doesn't really use? Prove to me that Elvis bought a Lexus and dug the sound system so much he had to contact Toyota and set up a shoot, and I might excuse him.
Otherwise, it's bullshit...and I'm not used to bullshit from Elvis Costello...
...sorry!
...so many good deeds, so little time
say the advertising agency swine
when man has destroyed what he thinks he owns
I hope no living thing cries iover his bones...
"Really, you know, he probably sold out when he decided to go professional as a rock star. It's all a gigantic mass deception, anyway."
ANCT :
"Haven't you noticed his major label record deals? His appearances on commercial television? His magazine interviews and photo shoots? His movie roles?"
Can't you see how that is different from taking a bag of cash from an advertising agency for promoting a product he doesn't really use? Prove to me that Elvis bought a Lexus and dug the sound system so much he had to contact Toyota and set up a shoot, and I might excuse him.
Otherwise, it's bullshit...and I'm not used to bullshit from Elvis Costello...
...sorry!
...so many good deeds, so little time
say the advertising agency swine
when man has destroyed what he thinks he owns
I hope no living thing cries iover his bones...
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And No Coffee Table
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Re: I already said it...
Prove to me that Elvis watched "Two and a Half Men" and "The Late Late Show With Craig Kilborn" and used their sponsors' products.A rope leash wrote:Prove to me that Elvis bought a Lexus and dug the sound system so much he had to contact Toyota and set up a shoot, and I might excuse him.
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Mr. Average
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1. Elvis is promoting the sales of Lexus Automobiles.
2. There is absolutely no distinction that the car he is promoting is limited to Hybrid lines. Not part of the advertisement at all. And I would be ashamed for him if he was so ignorant as to not see the ruse behind the hybrid thing. People buy hybrids because they make them "feel better". They have little to no effect on the environment or actual gas consumption. Effectively, purchasing a hybrid is tantamount to pissing in the ocean at hgh tide. It really makes no significant difference. That is a fact.
3. Elvis s getting a lot of money for the advertisements. He knows exactly what he is doing and is building a really good college fund for the kids.
4. Elvis, in my opinion, had artistic license to how these commercials were constructed. The ads are signature Elvis. Take 5 minutes and watch tv and consider the ads that sell cars. They are ludicrous. Dropping cars from helicopters. Cars attacked by the Loch Nesss Monster and surviving to live another day. Gimme a break. Elvis is using the industry evidence-base that shows that people buy cars largey for emotional reasons. He focuses on an emotional tag, the sound system. He knows EXACLY what he is doing.
5. Because he seems to have had artistic control, I accept the ad's. Never mind that I drive a 2006 Lexus ES. It is an "okay" vehicle. Nothing extraordinary, like the music of Elvis. I, pragmatically, declined the Mark Levinson sound system because it added significantly to my payment. I purchase a car to get from point A to point B...oh, and make my wife happy (she wanted the Lexus, I wanted an Acura TL).
6. Good commercial. At first I thought it risky for Lexus. But they know exactly what they are doing The beauty in the ad is that many of the people who view the commercial will KNOW that this is some famous dude, but they will have no freakin' idea who he is. That means the ad has an embedded contagion built in (read "The Tipping Point"). People will ask "Who is that guy?" and that wil promote discussion in the workplace, over drinks, at the club, etc.
7. The ad will sell cars to an audience that they desire.
8. I really don't worry about this at all. The rich get richer. Elvis Costello is an atheistic, a liberal, and a brilliant rock and roller. And he is a capitalist with a capital C. Face the music kiddo's. He is in it for the money. And he has earned that right.
9. The Elvis that sang Radio Radio on Saturday Night Live decades ago and effectively flipped off Lorne Michaels on Live TV would have never done this. He was a kid then. His priorities have changed. He is going to do more and more to line his pockets, for Dianna, the kids, and for himself. It is allowed. It is acceptable.
10. Good for Elvis Costello. I will not stop buying his music.
2. There is absolutely no distinction that the car he is promoting is limited to Hybrid lines. Not part of the advertisement at all. And I would be ashamed for him if he was so ignorant as to not see the ruse behind the hybrid thing. People buy hybrids because they make them "feel better". They have little to no effect on the environment or actual gas consumption. Effectively, purchasing a hybrid is tantamount to pissing in the ocean at hgh tide. It really makes no significant difference. That is a fact.
3. Elvis s getting a lot of money for the advertisements. He knows exactly what he is doing and is building a really good college fund for the kids.
4. Elvis, in my opinion, had artistic license to how these commercials were constructed. The ads are signature Elvis. Take 5 minutes and watch tv and consider the ads that sell cars. They are ludicrous. Dropping cars from helicopters. Cars attacked by the Loch Nesss Monster and surviving to live another day. Gimme a break. Elvis is using the industry evidence-base that shows that people buy cars largey for emotional reasons. He focuses on an emotional tag, the sound system. He knows EXACLY what he is doing.
5. Because he seems to have had artistic control, I accept the ad's. Never mind that I drive a 2006 Lexus ES. It is an "okay" vehicle. Nothing extraordinary, like the music of Elvis. I, pragmatically, declined the Mark Levinson sound system because it added significantly to my payment. I purchase a car to get from point A to point B...oh, and make my wife happy (she wanted the Lexus, I wanted an Acura TL).
6. Good commercial. At first I thought it risky for Lexus. But they know exactly what they are doing The beauty in the ad is that many of the people who view the commercial will KNOW that this is some famous dude, but they will have no freakin' idea who he is. That means the ad has an embedded contagion built in (read "The Tipping Point"). People will ask "Who is that guy?" and that wil promote discussion in the workplace, over drinks, at the club, etc.
7. The ad will sell cars to an audience that they desire.
8. I really don't worry about this at all. The rich get richer. Elvis Costello is an atheistic, a liberal, and a brilliant rock and roller. And he is a capitalist with a capital C. Face the music kiddo's. He is in it for the money. And he has earned that right.
9. The Elvis that sang Radio Radio on Saturday Night Live decades ago and effectively flipped off Lorne Michaels on Live TV would have never done this. He was a kid then. His priorities have changed. He is going to do more and more to line his pockets, for Dianna, the kids, and for himself. It is allowed. It is acceptable.
10. Good for Elvis Costello. I will not stop buying his music.
"The smarter mysteries are hidden in the light" - Jean Giono (1895-1970)
This is the lamest thread on the earth… oh, wait.. on the Internet.
A Rope Leash - You seem to be fixed on heading into a black abyss.
I want to know - why do you vicariously live through a man, like E.C., and rely on him to lead you and the world to righteousness?
You're a freak, man.
I'm here to appreciate E.C.'s past, present and future music.
BRING IT ON... "American Gangster Time" is a good start for 08!
As for the Lexus ad, and your trippy diatribe on why it's so wrong... I want to know where you work..?
Have you ever worked for a company that outsourced their U.S. workforce to India? What kind of clothes do you wear, and how and where were they manufactured?
Or Wait, ARL, maybe you're just madcap enough to simply wear burlap to buck the trend, like this citizen -
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.c ... 018&sc=307
(NB: Her burlap outfit in this photo is nothing like her threads in late 90s. She was a full-on Wizard of Oz scarecrow. Obviously, because of her foray into politics, she toned down her act - BUMMER.)
ANYHOW, Rope on a LESION...
If you want to hang on the topic of E.C.'s "so-called" sell out, then maybe you should take a look at yourself and decide how to make a difference in the world.
A Rope Leash - You seem to be fixed on heading into a black abyss.
I want to know - why do you vicariously live through a man, like E.C., and rely on him to lead you and the world to righteousness?
You're a freak, man.
I'm here to appreciate E.C.'s past, present and future music.
BRING IT ON... "American Gangster Time" is a good start for 08!
As for the Lexus ad, and your trippy diatribe on why it's so wrong... I want to know where you work..?
Have you ever worked for a company that outsourced their U.S. workforce to India? What kind of clothes do you wear, and how and where were they manufactured?
Or Wait, ARL, maybe you're just madcap enough to simply wear burlap to buck the trend, like this citizen -
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.c ... 018&sc=307
(NB: Her burlap outfit in this photo is nothing like her threads in late 90s. She was a full-on Wizard of Oz scarecrow. Obviously, because of her foray into politics, she toned down her act - BUMMER.)
ANYHOW, Rope on a LESION...
If you want to hang on the topic of E.C.'s "so-called" sell out, then maybe you should take a look at yourself and decide how to make a difference in the world.
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sweetest punch
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I see in this the hand of his new managers Steve Macklam and Sam Feldman. He is with a really BIG management team now (they manage also Diana Krall and Norah Jones) and you can tell that these guys are professionels: bringing Elvis's backcatalogue under one roof, the deal with iTunes (30 days exclusitivity), The Lexus ad, the VISA sponsoring,...
Since you put me down, it seems i've been very gloomy. You may laugh but pretty girls look right through me.
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A rope leash
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- Joined: Fri Jun 13, 2003 6:47 pm
- Location: southern misery, USA
Me
MOJO-
I work for a living. I trade my technological knowledge, labor, and service skills for money...and not nearly what I'm worth, either.
I turned down the highly lucractive officer corps in the USAF because I did not care for the elitism. They really do think they are better than the poor.
I belong to no religion, because it would be hypocrisy. I hate hypocrisy. To me, after a career of saying capitalists are all just bastards, doing a commercial for them is hypocrisy.
I buy my stuff at Wal-Mart, because it is basically the only store in town. I'm sorry that about half the jobs around here have been sent off to China, but I didn't do that, the capitalists who put profit above patriotism did that. Hey, I've lost more than one job at the alter of share-holder rights.
The point is, capitalism is rife with hypocrisy and unfairness. It's a big part of Elvis' songbook, and for him to do this now is hypocritical. I don't expect MOJO to see it that way, because maybe what MOJO sees in Elvis is not what I see and admire.
I work because I have to eat. Everybody is tied to the system, and living apart from it is nigh on impossible. That DOES NOT mean that we should all give up and get on our knees and display warm fealty to the corporation. We still have the right to stand up and demand that we be treated with fairness and respect. It doesn't help the cause to shill for one of the worst.
I work well, I should be paid well, but it isn't happening. The money is going onto the bank accounts of Lexus-driving fat-cats and into the construction of their glass and chrome towers. I'm sure most of the ad-addled consumer-bots on this board think that's fine, but not me, I'm a rebel, just like Elvis USED to be.
...and, lame? I'll tell you what's lame....6 sitcom characters...New Order breaking up...It's my birthday!...what are you listening to? something really cool I bet...the radio said so!
I'll tell you what else is lame. Elvis was on Letterman last night, and no one has bothered to make a post about it yet.
I work for a living. I trade my technological knowledge, labor, and service skills for money...and not nearly what I'm worth, either.
I turned down the highly lucractive officer corps in the USAF because I did not care for the elitism. They really do think they are better than the poor.
I belong to no religion, because it would be hypocrisy. I hate hypocrisy. To me, after a career of saying capitalists are all just bastards, doing a commercial for them is hypocrisy.
I buy my stuff at Wal-Mart, because it is basically the only store in town. I'm sorry that about half the jobs around here have been sent off to China, but I didn't do that, the capitalists who put profit above patriotism did that. Hey, I've lost more than one job at the alter of share-holder rights.
The point is, capitalism is rife with hypocrisy and unfairness. It's a big part of Elvis' songbook, and for him to do this now is hypocritical. I don't expect MOJO to see it that way, because maybe what MOJO sees in Elvis is not what I see and admire.
I work because I have to eat. Everybody is tied to the system, and living apart from it is nigh on impossible. That DOES NOT mean that we should all give up and get on our knees and display warm fealty to the corporation. We still have the right to stand up and demand that we be treated with fairness and respect. It doesn't help the cause to shill for one of the worst.
I work well, I should be paid well, but it isn't happening. The money is going onto the bank accounts of Lexus-driving fat-cats and into the construction of their glass and chrome towers. I'm sure most of the ad-addled consumer-bots on this board think that's fine, but not me, I'm a rebel, just like Elvis USED to be.
...and, lame? I'll tell you what's lame....6 sitcom characters...New Order breaking up...It's my birthday!...what are you listening to? something really cool I bet...the radio said so!
I'll tell you what else is lame. Elvis was on Letterman last night, and no one has bothered to make a post about it yet.
Last edited by A rope leash on Sat May 19, 2007 9:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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A rope leash
- Posts: 1835
- Joined: Fri Jun 13, 2003 6:47 pm
- Location: southern misery, USA
More about me
Also, MOJO...
I am a freak. I've been a freak all my life, and a damn good-looking one at that. I like who and what I am, because it sure beats being bland and ordinary...like say, you?
What am I doing to change the world? Well, I'm not supporting back-stabbing idols like Elvis anymore, for one thing. Everyone knows I speak out for what I support, and believe it or not, things are changing somewhat because of people like me. Americans used to be 80% behind our demented pResident, but thanks to people like me who would not shut up, he is now seen as the evil he is, and not God's gift.
What are you doing to change the world? Going to another concert, buying another CD? Tell your boss you're worth more, and demand a raise, a big one, and see what happens. If you don't get it, then organize a strike. See what happens.
I tell it like it is, and I always have. The truth is never accepted at first glance. I wouldn't be a compliant consumer-bot for anything in the world..things do not make me happy, ideas do.
By the way, are you making fun of the way the artist in your link is dressed? I see nothing wrong with it, nor do I mind being compared with it. Was that supposed to be an insult? You should really not fuck with what you do not know about, like the dog.
...and while the signals took an age to change
it was easy pickins...
I am a freak. I've been a freak all my life, and a damn good-looking one at that. I like who and what I am, because it sure beats being bland and ordinary...like say, you?
What am I doing to change the world? Well, I'm not supporting back-stabbing idols like Elvis anymore, for one thing. Everyone knows I speak out for what I support, and believe it or not, things are changing somewhat because of people like me. Americans used to be 80% behind our demented pResident, but thanks to people like me who would not shut up, he is now seen as the evil he is, and not God's gift.
What are you doing to change the world? Going to another concert, buying another CD? Tell your boss you're worth more, and demand a raise, a big one, and see what happens. If you don't get it, then organize a strike. See what happens.
I tell it like it is, and I always have. The truth is never accepted at first glance. I wouldn't be a compliant consumer-bot for anything in the world..things do not make me happy, ideas do.
By the way, are you making fun of the way the artist in your link is dressed? I see nothing wrong with it, nor do I mind being compared with it. Was that supposed to be an insult? You should really not fuck with what you do not know about, like the dog.
...and while the signals took an age to change
it was easy pickins...
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Mr. Average
- Posts: 2031
- Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2003 12:22 pm
- Location: Orange County, Californication
Incredible. The New Cadillac positioning: The Cadillac Bose Edition, featuring a Bose Sound System. I think it is the CDS series? Anyway, the ad copy features the Bose Sound System as the leading feature, followed by trivial things like leather seats and horsepower...the things that you would think would lead the list of features for a premium new car.
It is literally called the Cadillac Bose Edition. So Lexus and Cadillac are pushing premium automobiles based first on high fidelity sound systems. Incredible.
It is literally called the Cadillac Bose Edition. So Lexus and Cadillac are pushing premium automobiles based first on high fidelity sound systems. Incredible.
"The smarter mysteries are hidden in the light" - Jean Giono (1895-1970)
http://www.dhadm.com/content/lexus-audi ... d-version/
May 22nd, 2007
Lexus Audio Perfection - Extended Version
by: DS
I really like this commercial. It’s a smart approach for “perfectionâ€
May 22nd, 2007
Lexus Audio Perfection - Extended Version
by: DS
I really like this commercial. It’s a smart approach for “perfectionâ€
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Who Shot Sam?
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verbal gymnastics
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Well put pophead.
Elvis has changed this century as far as the corporates are concerned - the concert for AskJeeves for example. His latest tour is sponsored by Visa.
He has also changed in the company he keeps and I dareday a lot of that is because of Diana. Isn't he managed by Diana's management company now...?
I should think most of us have become people in part that we never would have thought of becoming 10/15/20 years ago.
Elvis has changed this century as far as the corporates are concerned - the concert for AskJeeves for example. His latest tour is sponsored by Visa.
He has also changed in the company he keeps and I dareday a lot of that is because of Diana. Isn't he managed by Diana's management company now...?
I should think most of us have become people in part that we never would have thought of becoming 10/15/20 years ago.
Who’s this kid with his mumbo jumbo?
But the difference, VG, as I see it, is that EC does not own up to what he has become. Not one of his public pronouncements even remotely informs us that yes, as a 50ish Baby Boomer he has exercised his right to go corporate, with the requisite cool, of course (that's where I part company, by the way, corporate yes, cool no).
He's still feeding us the usual bullshit (music corps bad; corporate rock bad; corporations greedy etc.).
Also, I would argue that just because he has evolved into what he has evolved does not mean that he is free from criticism for it, precisely because of his hypocricy. When you are a millionaire and you opt to sell cars and credit cards, pose for pictures for credit card honchos, play private shows for the Yahoos and Jeeves of this corporate world, spare me the lectures on corporate greed and the holier than thou act.
He's still feeding us the usual bullshit (music corps bad; corporate rock bad; corporations greedy etc.).
Also, I would argue that just because he has evolved into what he has evolved does not mean that he is free from criticism for it, precisely because of his hypocricy. When you are a millionaire and you opt to sell cars and credit cards, pose for pictures for credit card honchos, play private shows for the Yahoos and Jeeves of this corporate world, spare me the lectures on corporate greed and the holier than thou act.
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laughingcrow
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verbal gymnastics
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I wasn't disagreeing alexv - indeed I was supporting pophead's views on the previous page. I agree with you as well but I haven't seen any corporate greed attacks by Elvis of late. When I do that's when the REAL discussions start...
Elvis Costello's views are brought to you by Microsoft...
Elvis Costello's views are brought to you by Microsoft...
Who’s this kid with his mumbo jumbo?