Is this a fair analogy

[ice nine]

EC: PTC:: David Bowie: Let's Dance

[Extreme Honey]

EC: PTC:: David Bowie: Let's Dance

Allright.
EC: Mighty Like a Rose:: The Beach Boys: Pet Sounds

[BlueChair]

hahahahahahahahahahahahahah

[Miss Macbeth]

Same here, Blue, LOL!!!!!!!!!

[BlueChair]

MLAR is better equated to something like Carl & The Passions... a good album, but hardly a masterpeice

[selfmademug]

...not that Ice was even asking for another one.

No, I don't think so, to answer your question, but that's just my opinion and I can see why you'd make the comparison. I don't think Elvis has a Let's Dance.

Otis will be all over this!

[Who Shot Sam?]

...not that Ice was even asking for another one.

No, I don't think so, to answer your question, but that's just my opinion and I can see why you'd make the comparison. I don't think Elvis has a Let's Dance.

Otis will be all over this!

Nothing wrong with Let's Dance if you ask me - lots of great tunes on there. Now if you're talking about some of the albums that followed it...

[Miss Macbeth]

Haha, so you're trying to start trouble again huh, muggy?
I luv a good fight!

I wouldn't even attempt to make that comparison.

[Chrille]

I think Let's Dance is a better than album than Punch the Clock to be honest, not that I think either of them are great.

[Mr. Average]

Ice, it's a fair analogy if it is generally accepted that the desired outcome/audience for these two recordings was pop/mainstream. However, if considered as a contest with some metric of success in hitting that pop/mainstream audience, Bowie wins the walk-off and he didn't need to resort to removing his underwear to pull it off (sorry for the bad pun).

I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say that Bowie had a much better headstart into formula pop than did Elvis. Better portfolio of pure pop with wide audience appeal that culminates in "Let's Dance". Elvis was already all over the map, with PTC not far behind such diverse efforts as Army Forces (New Wave) Almost Blue (Country) and Get Happy (Motown/Philly Soul homage). Not much momentum to carry into PTC, when compared to "Let's Dance". Without trying to be controversial, I suppose I see Bowies's experimental dalliances (and successes) as occuring 'en batch' earlier in his career, and Elvis' musical meandersings being more 'real time' with respect to the proximity to the release of PTC.

My strained analogy that will probably work only for me adds to the equation:

Gang of Four "Entertainment" with Stiff Little Fingers "Go For It" with The Jam "All Mod Cons"

[Jackson Monk]

I think Let's Dance is a better than album than Punch the Clock to be honest, not that I think either of them are great.

Personally I'd go the other way. I still periodically play PTC, I haven't played LD since 1983!

[bambooneedle]

Interesting theory, but where's the equivalent of Modern Love on PTC?

[ice nine]

I remember people's discussions that David Bowie had 'sold out' (atleast, people in the 'know' about music) when Let's Dance came out. I agree with Mr. A. in that Bowie and EC were trying to expand their fan base with each respective release.

[selfmademug]

I think Let's Dance is a better than album than Punch the Clock to be honest, not that I think either of them are great.

Personally I'd go the other way. I still periodically play PTC, I haven't played LD since 1983!

Ditto for me. I love PTC; it's not in my top five or anything but it's a great record.

[TheImposter]

I think Imperial Bedroom would be his Pet Sounds/Pepper.

Probably the artist whose catalogue EC's is best analogous to is Dylan:

This Year's Model: Highway 61

Almost Blue: Nashville Skyline (or Self Portrait if you're being uncharitable)

King Of America: Blood On The Tracks

[Otis Westinghouse]

Ditto for me. I love PTC; it's not in my top five or anything but it's a great record.

Tempted not to contribute, it's too predictable of me, and life doesn't work this way, but not ditto for me as I wouldn't have Let's Dance in the house until it was forced upon me last Christmas (you know who you are, and I am grateful, honest ). I've played it at least once. But PTC is so obviously the better LP and is the only one of these worth spending time on.

[stormwarning]

When PTC was released it was a very good album and the NME (for example) raved about it. It just feels a little dated now.

The problem with Let's Dance is that it was poor at the time of release and is still poor now. DB himself would echo that statement. What made it even more disappointing was that it followed the excellent Scary Monsters, which for 2 years was rarely off my turntable.

I would say that Let's Dance is akin to 'Jazz' by Queen - both sounded like the beginning of the end.

[Extreme Honey]

I think Imperial Bedroom would be his Pet Sounds/Pepper.

Probably the artist whose catalogue EC's is best analogous to is Dylan:

This Year's Model: Highway 61

Almost Blue: Nashville Skyline (or Self Portrait if you're being uncharitable)

King Of America: Blood On The Tracks

Hold on there cowboy, Pet Sounds/Pepper are the 2 greatest albums of all time! I love Mr.Costello as well, but let's not overcredit the man! And besides, MLAR is better than IB, we all know that (...NOT!) . But the other comparisions are accurate I think. Especially TYM:H61R, because they were both made at early points in their careers and they both sold extremely well, although obiously more commercial albums they are both far from their artist's best. KoA and BOTT is a good comparison as well.

Okay than how about this?: painted From Memory: Love and theft?????

[Jackson Monk]

People can laugh at me, but I think Imperial Bedroom is one of the greatest albums ever and stands up very well against Pet Sounds. I happen to think its a better record than Pepper, which is the Beatles most over-rated record and not on the same playing field as Abbey Rd, Revolver, Rubber Soul or the White Album.

So there

[Otis Westinghouse]

A friend who is a Costello-fancier, though typically the earlier years only, but disses IB, calling it Imperial Boredom. Very odd.

[Extreme Honey]

A friend who is a Costello-fancier, though typically the earlier years only, but disses IB, calling it Imperial Boredom. Very odd.

That is quite odd for the a pre-trusty (as I like to call 'em). Take a look at what I've found on Amazon:

Too much touring and booze!, January 3, 2005
Reviewer: Renaldo Rigatoni (Elkhart, IN USA) - See all my reviews

Am I the only one out there who sees a steady decline in the quality of EC's albums from "This Year's Model" (his best) to "Goodbye Cruel World" (his worst)?

I'm going out on a limb, but I think EC's first two albums are the finest work he ever did. "My Aim is True" features excellent lyrics with musical accompaniment provided by a hired backup band, Clover. "This Year's Model" was an improvement. It featured the work of EC's own band, the Attractions, who added a tightness to the sound because these tunes had been refined on the road. "This Year's Model" also had lyrics which included many puns, but they worked well. The puns didn't overshadow the lyrics, and the tight, visceral music drove everything home with perfection.

After "This Year's Model" EC broadened his lyrical and musical approach. The lyrics became denser and oftentimes featured puns evolving into more puns. The music became broader and incorporated more styles. After their second album, EC and the Attractions toured constantly with rare breaks for more recording.

"Imperial Bedroom" is the result of a composer and a band that has had too much touring and too many nights of chemical abuse. The lyrics sound good, but are so obtuse they could mean anything. And in meaning anythng, they could just as easily mean nothing. The music sounds good, but takes us in so many directions we end up wondering where we went and question whether we should have spent the time going there in the first place. The album leaves you disoriented. The listener feels an unpleasant combination of jet lag and hangover.

EC's albums from "Armed Forces" up to "Goodbye Cruel World" leave me feeling this strange combination of jet lag and hangover. I feel like I've seen and heard life from EC's vantage point of airports, vans, bars, and recording studios. But I feel like I don't quite understand what I've seen and heard. The result is like seeing the world passing by from a window, either a jet window or a van window, and getting a vague image that passes through your senses quickly only to be replaced my another vague image. This is the way I feel listening to EC's lyrics on these post-"This Year's Model" albums. Individual songs don't mean anything specific, they are collections of images and puns which mean everything or nothing. Entire albums are obtuse because they are merely a collection of individual songs that don't mean anything specific.

I've listened to "Imperial Bedrooms" regularly since I first bought it on vinyl back in 1982. I still don't "understand" the album. It is enjoyable to listen to, but I never feel the way I do when I listen to EC's first two albums.

Maybe there's something wrong with me? But I prefer EC when he was young, angry, and focused.

Any Comments on this one?

[verena]

Ex. Honey, I have read the Rigatone guy paper for your sake, you forgave me a bad insult and I wouldn’t want to let your nice request for comments lost in the air.

I hope that I can fare all right this time, my wording may not suit you. Should it be insulting or inadequate, kindly do not fire at me in public E.H., will you (e mail me we can talk it over).

I found this review full of feeling and insight, but I do not share the views expressed.

For starters I do not follow the raving as to the first 2 albums. Cannot comment in fact, I do not own these 2 ! And I would be unable to compare albums, that would require a number of listens and a knowledge that I don’t have. However I read a fair amount of lyrics, and (saw deep) purchased 7 or 8 albums. I came across wonderful lines in everyone one them.

I do agree with the point made on the “puns”, in general. To me the more puns the bigger the headache (thanks to Midol, the medicine, for working wonders in this regard for me).

I do not agree with the idea that Imperial Bedroom’s lyrics are no good because they seem to mean all or nothing. What is exactly meant in poetry does not matter, and it better not be too specific, precisely. To me the key is in the words and how they are arranged, this determines the music and the emotion which is conveyed.

The sentences concerning “the world passing by” “in vague images” “from a window” are actually quite beautiful. It does feel like the writer is hinting at a sort of existence he himself led. Meanwhile to me the inner qualities of either the existence or the person affected are of no importance whatsoever.

From an artistic standpoint you have to separate the lyrics from the life, don’t you?

[Extreme Honey]

Ex. Honey, I have read the Rigatone guy paper for your sake, you forgave me a bad insult and I wouldn’t want to let your nice request for comments lost in the air.

I hope that I can fare all right this time, my wording may not suit you. Should it be insulting or inadequate, kindly do not fire at me in public E.H., will you (e mail me we can talk it over).

I found this review full of feeling and insight, but I do not share the views expressed.

For starters I do not follow the raving as to the first 2 albums. Cannot comment in fact, I do not own these 2 ! And I would be unable to compare albums, that would require a number of listens and a knowledge that I don’t have. However I read a fair amount of lyrics, and (saw deep) purchased 7 or 8 albums. I came across wonderful lines in everyone one them.

I do agree with the point made on the “puns”, in general. To me the more puns the bigger the headache (thanks to Midol, the medicine, for working wonders in this regard for me).

I do not agree with the idea that Imperial Bedroom’s lyrics are no good because they seem to mean all or nothing. What is exactly meant in poetry does not matter, and it better not be too specific, precisely. To me the key is in the words and how they are arranged, this determines the music and the emotion which is conveyed.

The sentences concerning “the world passing by” “in vague images” “from a window” are actually quite beautiful. It does feel like the writer is hinting at a sort of existence he himself led. Meanwhile to me the inner qualities of either the existence or the person affected are of no importance whatsoever.

From an artistic standpoint you have to separate the lyrics from the life, don’t you?

I completely agree. Costello's first 2 albums are "Meh" and his other ones are "Yeh". Don't worry about m verna, I'm just a young howlin' dog looking to annoy. So asically, this guy is an idiot...okay, I'm happy with that (even though I know many would agree on his Pre-Trusty nature)

[verena]

E.H : I do not think the writer is an idiot at all. I just do not feel the same, I am not making a judgement here.

Please, what do you mean with "pre-Trusty" nature ?